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TPLL TPL Life Insurance Limited

Latest results: FY2025 · Dec 2025 Q2 FY2026 · Apr – Jun 2026

Last close · 16 Oct 2026

Rs 18.85 +1.89%

Quarterly · Q3 FY2021 – Q2 FY2026

TPL Life Insurance Limited (TPLL) quarterly income statement

TPL Life Insurance Limited reported total income of Rs 153.7 mn for Q2 FY2026 (Apr – Jun 2026), up 8.8% on Q2 FY2025. The loss attributable to shareholders was Rs 58.0 mn, or Rs -0.26 per share.

TPLL income statement (quarterly) (Rs mn)
Rs mn TTM to Jun 2026 Q2 FY2026 Apr – Jun 2026 Q1 FY2026 Jan – Mar 2026 Q4 FY2025 Oct – Dec 2025 Q3 FY2025 Jul – Sep 2025 Q2 FY2025 Apr – Jun 2025 Q1 FY2025 Jan – Mar 2025 Q4 FY2024 Oct – Dec 2024 Q3 FY2024 Jul – Sep 2024 Q2 FY2024 Apr – Jun 2024 Q1 FY2024 Jul – Sep 2023 Q4 FY2023 Apr – Jun 2023 Q3 FY2023 Jan – Mar 2023 Q2 FY2023 Oct – Dec 2022 Q1 FY2023 Jul – Sep 2022 Q4 FY2022 Apr – Jun 2022 Q3 FY2022 Jan – Mar 2022 Q2 FY2022 Oct – Dec 2021 Q1 FY2022 Jul – Sep 2021 Q4 FY2021 Apr – Jun 2021 Q3 FY2021 Jan – Mar 2021
Net premium earned 476.7 143.7 143.1 98.6 91.3 131.4 98.5 240.2 54.7 0.0 — — — — — — — — — — —
Total income 513.8 153.7 156.7 100.4 103.0 141.3 110.6 265.4 75.1 0.0 5.5 0.0 0.0 0.0 0.0 0.0 0.0 0.0 0.0 0.0 0.0
Net claims & benefits (60.5) (10.5) (17.6) (7.0) (25.3) (32.5) (17.8) (36.0) (25.4) 0.0 — — — — — — — — — — —
Profit before tax (221.7) (63.0) (41.2) (57.5) (59.9) (61.0) (29.8) (224.7) (68.5) (52.3) (1.8) (5.4) (4.8) (0.6) (4.2) (46.6) (47.9) 325.1 3.3 20.9 2.1
Taxation 6.0 5.0 (5.0) 8.4 (2.4) (4.1) (2.0) 1.4 (0.2) (0.6) (0.1) 0.0 0.0 0.0 0.0 0.7 0.0 (2.4) (1.3) (1.4) (1.0)
Profit after tax (215.6) (58.0) (46.3) (49.1) (62.3) (65.0) (31.8) (223.3) (68.7) (52.8) (1.9) (5.4) (4.8) (0.6) (4.2) (45.8) (47.9) 322.7 1.9 19.5 1.0
Profit attributable to shareholders (215.6) (58.0) (46.3) (49.1) (62.3) (65.0) (31.8) (223.3) (68.7) (52.8) (1.9) (5.4) (4.8) (0.6) (4.2) (45.8) (47.9) 322.7 1.9 19.5 1.0
Per share
EPS – basic (Rs) Rs (0.97) (0.26) (0.21) (0.22) (0.28) (0.29) (0.14) (1.07) (0.31) (0.24) (0.23) (0.67) (0.60) (0.07) (0.52) (5.73) (5.98) 40.33 0.24 2.44 0.13
Dividend per share (Rs) Rs 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00
TPLL income statement — year-on-year change (Rs mn)
Rs mn Q2 FY2026 Apr – Jun 2026 Q1 FY2026 Jan – Mar 2026 Q4 FY2025 Oct – Dec 2025 Q3 FY2025 Jul – Sep 2025 Q2 FY2025 Apr – Jun 2025 Q1 FY2025 Jan – Mar 2025 Q4 FY2024 Oct – Dec 2024 Q3 FY2024 Jul – Sep 2024 Q2 FY2024 Apr – Jun 2024 Q1 FY2024 Jul – Sep 2023 Q4 FY2023 Apr – Jun 2023 Q3 FY2023 Jan – Mar 2023 Q2 FY2023 Oct – Dec 2022 Q1 FY2023 Jul – Sep 2022 Q4 FY2022 Apr – Jun 2022 Q3 FY2022 Jan – Mar 2022 Q2 FY2022 Oct – Dec 2021 Q1 FY2022 Jul – Sep 2021 Q4 FY2021 Apr – Jun 2021 Q3 FY2021 Jan – Mar 2021
Net premium earned +9.3% +45.4% -59.0% +66.9% — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — —
Total income +8.8% +41.7% -62.2% +37.1% — +1,914.3% — — — — — — — — — — — — — —
Net claims & benefits -67.7% -0.8% -80.4% -0.7% — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — —
Profit before tax — — — — — — — — — — — — -100.2% -228.1% -322.6% -2,430.3% +12,803.6% +22.8% — —
Taxation -224.0% +156.5% — +1,263.6% +621.5% +2,757.4% — — — — — — -100.0% -100.0% -154.0% -100.0% +22.4% +36.4% -48.1% —
Profit after tax — — — — — — — — — — — — -100.2% -315.3% -334.5% -4,846.2% +58,097.3% +14.9% — —
Profit attributable to shareholders — — — — — — — — — — — — -100.2% -315.3% -334.5% -4,846.2% +58,097.3% +14.9% — —
Per share
EPS – basic (Rs) — — — — — — — — — — — — -100.2% -315.3% -334.5% -4,846.0% +58,099.0% +14.9% — —
Dividend per share (Rs) — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — — —

Change against the same quarter a year earlier; shown when the earlier figure is positive.

TPLL income statement — common size (Rs mn)
Rs mn Q2 FY2026 Apr – Jun 2026 Q1 FY2026 Jan – Mar 2026 Q4 FY2025 Oct – Dec 2025 Q3 FY2025 Jul – Sep 2025 Q2 FY2025 Apr – Jun 2025 Q1 FY2025 Jan – Mar 2025 Q4 FY2024 Oct – Dec 2024 Q3 FY2024 Jul – Sep 2024 Q2 FY2024 Apr – Jun 2024 Q1 FY2024 Jul – Sep 2023 Q4 FY2023 Apr – Jun 2023 Q3 FY2023 Jan – Mar 2023 Q2 FY2023 Oct – Dec 2022 Q1 FY2023 Jul – Sep 2022 Q4 FY2022 Apr – Jun 2022 Q3 FY2022 Jan – Mar 2022 Q2 FY2022 Oct – Dec 2021 Q1 FY2022 Jul – Sep 2021 Q4 FY2021 Apr – Jun 2021 Q3 FY2021 Jan – Mar 2021
Net premium earned 93.4% 91.4% 98.2% 88.7% 93.0% 89.0% 90.5% 72.8% — — — — — — — — — — — —
Total income 100.0% 100.0% 100.0% 100.0% 100.0% 100.0% 100.0% 100.0% — 100.0% — — — — — — — — — —
Net claims & benefits (6.8%) (11.3%) (7.0%) (24.5%) (23.0%) (16.1%) (13.6%) (33.8%) — — — — — — — — — — — —
Profit before tax (41.0%) (26.3%) (57.3%) (58.2%) (43.1%) (27.0%) (84.7%) (91.2%) — (32.5%) — — — — — — — — — —
Taxation 3.3% (3.2%) 8.4% (2.3%) (2.9%) (1.8%) 0.5% (0.2%) — (1.3%) — — — — — — — — — —
Profit after tax (37.7%) (29.5%) (48.9%) (60.5%) (46.0%) (28.8%) (84.1%) (91.5%) — (33.8%) — — — — — — — — — —
Profit attributable to shareholders (37.7%) (29.5%) (48.9%) (60.5%) (46.0%) (28.8%) (84.1%) (91.5%) — (33.8%) — — — — — — — — — —

Each line as a percentage of total income.

Figures in Pakistani rupees as reported by the company; costs and cash outflows in brackets; "—" = not reported. TTM = the latest four quarters added together. Updated 17 Oct 2026.

All reported line items 97
TPLL income statement — all reported line items (Rs mn)
Rs mn Q2 FY2026 Apr – Jun 2026 Q1 FY2026 Jan – Mar 2026 Q4 FY2025 Oct – Dec 2025 Q3 FY2025 Jul – Sep 2025 Q2 FY2025 Apr – Jun 2025 Q1 FY2025 Jan – Mar 2025 Q4 FY2024 Oct – Dec 2024 Q3 FY2024 Jul – Sep 2024 Q2 FY2024 Apr – Jun 2024 Q1 FY2024 Jul – Sep 2023 Q4 FY2023 Apr – Jun 2023 Q3 FY2023 Jan – Mar 2023
Net Premiums Earned 143.7 143.1 98.6 91.3 131.4 98.5 240.2 54.7 0.0 — — —
Revenue from Goods & Services — — — — — — — — — 5.5 0.0 0.0
Sales of Goods & Services - Net - Unclassified — — — — — — — — — 5.5 0.0 0.0
Premiums Written - Gross 164.9 188.6 106.5 114.6 147.7 137.1 323.8 68.0 0.0 — — —
Premiums Ceded Out & Unearned - Reinsurance 21.2 45.4 7.9 23.3 16.3 38.6 83.6 13.3 0.0 — — —
Premiums Ceded Out to Reinsurance - Written 21.2 45.4 7.9 23.3 16.3 38.6 83.6 13.3 0.0 — — —
Investments & Loans - Business - Gain/(Loss) 10.1 13.5 1.8 11.7 9.9 12.1 25.2 20.4 0.0 — — —
Investment Securities - Business - Gain/(Loss) 10.1 13.5 1.8 11.7 9.9 12.1 25.2 20.4 0.0 — — —
Revenue from Business Activities - Total 153.7 156.7 100.4 103.0 141.3 110.6 265.4 75.1 0.0 5.5 0.0 0.0
Insurance Claims/Reserves - Total 10.5 17.6 7.0 25.3 32.5 17.8 36.0 25.4 0.0 — — —
Cost of Operating Revenue — — — — — — — — — 5.1 0.0 0.0
Insurance Benefits Paid - Current 10.5 17.6 7.0 25.3 32.5 17.8 36.0 25.4 0.0 — — —
Cost of Revenues - Total — — — — — — — — — 5.1 0.0 0.0
Selling, General & Administrative Expenses - Total 88.5 79.4 90.1 81.5 73.2 63.5 415.9 71.4 1.8 2.8 4.3 4.5
Other Operating Expense/(Income) - Net 44.0 43.0 24.2 7.1 41.8 28.0 (34.0) 25.5 50.4 (0.6) (0.8) 0.3
Other Operating Income - Total 9.1 — — — 11.1 — — — — 0.6 3.0 1.6
Gross Profit - Industrials/Property - Total — — — — — — — — — 0.4 0.0 0.0
Operating Expenses - Total 143.0 140.0 121.4 113.8 147.6 109.3 417.8 122.3 52.3 7.3 3.5 4.8
Operating Profit before Non-Recurring Income/(Expense) 10.7 16.6 (21.0) (10.8) (6.2) 1.3 (152.4) (47.2) (52.3) (1.8) (3.5) (4.8)
Financing Income/(Expense) - Net - Total — — — — — — — — — (0.0) (1.8) (0.0)
Interest Expense - Net of (Interest Income) — — — — — — — — — 0.0 1.8 0.0
Other Operating Expense 53.1 — — — 53.0 — — — — — 2.2 1.9
Interest Expense - Net of Capitalized Interest 9.2 0.1 4.1 0.1 4.0 2.0 10.5 0.2 0.0 0.0 1.8 0.0
Other Non-Operating Income/(Expense) - Total (64.6) (57.8) (32.3) (49.0) (50.8) (29.2) (61.8) (21.1) 0.0 — — —
Normalized Pre-tax Profit (63.0) (41.2) (57.5) (59.9) (61.0) (29.8) (224.7) (68.5) (52.3) (1.8) (5.4) (4.8)
Non-Recurring Income/Expense - Total — — — — — — — — 0.0 — — —
Fair Value Adjustments - Financial Investments — — — — — — — — 0.0 — — —
Provision for Income Tax Expense- Unclassified (5.0) 5.0 (8.4) 2.4 4.1 2.0 (1.4) 0.2 0.6 0.1 0.0 0.0
Income before Taxes (63.0) (41.2) (57.5) (59.9) (61.0) (29.8) (224.7) (68.5) (52.3) (1.8) (5.4) (4.8)
Income Taxes (5.0) 5.0 (8.4) 2.4 4.1 2.0 (1.4) 0.2 0.6 0.1 0.0 0.0
Net Income after Tax (58.0) (46.3) (49.1) (62.3) (65.0) (31.8) (223.3) (68.7) (52.8) (1.9) (5.4) (4.8)
Income before Discontinued Operations & Extraordinary Items (58.0) (46.3) (49.1) (62.3) (65.0) (31.8) (223.3) (68.7) (52.8) (1.9) (5.4) (4.8)
Net Income before Minority Interest (58.0) (46.3) (49.1) (62.3) (65.0) (31.8) (223.3) (68.7) (52.8) (1.9) (5.4) (4.8)
Net Income after Minority Interest (58.0) (46.3) (49.1) (62.3) (65.0) (31.8) (223.3) (68.7) (52.8) (1.9) (5.4) (4.8)
Income Available to Common Shares (58.0) (46.3) (49.1) (62.3) (65.0) (31.8) (223.3) (68.7) (52.8) (1.9) (5.4) (4.8)
Earnings Adjustments to Net Income - Other Expense/(Income) — — — — (0.0) — (0.0) — — — — —
DPS - Common - Gross - Issue - By Period End Date Rs 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00
Net Income - Basic - including Extraordinary Items Applicable to Common - Total (58.0) (46.3) (49.1) (62.3) (65.0) (31.8) (223.3) (68.7) (52.8) (1.9) (5.4) (4.8)
Income available to Common excluding Extraordinary Items (58.0) (46.3) (49.1) (62.3) (65.0) (31.8) (223.3) (68.7) (52.8) (1.9) (5.4) (4.8)
Shares used to calculate Basic EPS - Total mn 223.1 220.4 225.7 222.5 224.2 227.1 208.5 224.5 224.5 8.0 8.0 8.0
EPS - Basic - including Extraordinary Items Applicable to Common - Total Rs (0.26) (0.21) (0.22) (0.28) (0.29) (0.14) (1.07) (0.31) (0.24) (0.23) (0.67) (0.60)
EPS - Basic - excluding Extraordinary Items Applicable to Common - Total Rs (0.26) (0.21) (0.22) (0.28) (0.29) (0.14) (1.07) (0.31) (0.24) (0.23) (0.67) (0.60)
EPS - Basic - excluding Extraordinary Items - Normalized - Total Rs (0.26) (0.21) (0.22) (0.28) (0.29) (0.14) (1.07) (0.31) (0.24) (0.23) (0.67) (0.60)
Allocated Net Income including Extraordinary Items Applicable to Common - Issue Specific (58.0) (46.3) (49.1) (62.3) (65.0) (31.8) (223.3) (68.7) (52.8) (1.9) (5.4) (4.8)
Earnings Allocation Factor - Basic - Issue Specific 1.00× 1.00× 1.00× 1.00× 1.00× 1.00× 1.00× 1.00× 1.00× 1.00× 1.00× 1.00×
Shares used to calculate Basic EPS - Issue Specific mn 223.1 220.4 225.7 222.5 224.2 227.1 208.5 224.5 224.5 8.0 8.0 8.0
EPS - Basic - including Extraordinary Items Applicable to Common - Issue Specific Rs (0.26) (0.21) (0.22) (0.28) (0.29) (0.14) (1.07) (0.31) (0.24) (0.23) (0.67) (0.60)
EPS - Basic - excluding Extraordinary Items Applicable to Common - Issue Specific Rs (0.26) (0.21) (0.22) (0.28) (0.29) (0.14) (1.07) (0.31) (0.24) (0.23) (0.67) (0.60)
EPS - Basic - excluding Extraordinary Items - Normalized - Issue Specific Rs (0.26) (0.21) (0.22) (0.28) (0.29) (0.14) (1.07) (0.31) (0.24) (0.23) (0.67) (0.60)
EPS - Basic from Discontinued Operations & Extraordinary Items Rs 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00
Net Income - Diluted - including Extraordinary Items Applicable to Common - Total (58.0) (46.3) (49.1) (62.3) (65.0) (31.8) (223.3) (68.7) (52.8) (1.9) (5.4) (4.8)
Diluted Income available to Common excluding Extraordinary Items (58.0) (46.3) (49.1) (62.3) (65.0) (31.8) (223.3) (68.7) (52.8) (1.9) (5.4) (4.8)
Shares used to calculate Diluted EPS - Total mn 223.1 220.4 225.7 222.5 224.2 227.1 208.5 224.5 224.5 8.0 8.0 8.0
EPS - Diluted - including Extraordinary Items Applicable to Common - Total Rs (0.26) (0.21) (0.22) (0.28) (0.29) (0.14) (1.07) (0.31) (0.24) (0.23) (0.67) (0.60)
EPS - Diluted - excluding Extraordinary Items Applicable to Common - Total Rs (0.26) (0.21) (0.22) (0.28) (0.29) (0.14) (1.07) (0.31) (0.24) (0.23) (0.67) (0.60)
EPS - Diluted - excluding Extraordinary Items - Normalized - Total Rs (0.26) (0.21) (0.22) (0.28) (0.29) (0.14) (1.07) (0.31) (0.24) (0.23) (0.67) (0.60)
Allocated Diluted Net Income including Extraordinary Items Applicable to Common - Issue Specific (58.0) (46.3) (49.1) (62.3) (65.0) (31.8) (223.3) (68.7) (52.8) (1.9) (5.4) (4.8)
Earnings Allocation Factor - Diluted - Issue Specific 1.00× 1.00× 1.00× 1.00× 1.00× 1.00× 1.00× 1.00× 1.00× 1.00× 1.00× 1.00×
Shares used to calculate Diluted EPS - Issue Specific mn 223.1 220.4 225.7 222.5 224.2 227.1 208.5 224.5 224.5 8.0 8.0 8.0
EPS - Diluted - including Extraordinary Items Applicable to Common - Issue Specific Rs (0.26) (0.21) (0.22) (0.28) (0.29) (0.14) (1.07) (0.31) (0.24) (0.23) (0.67) (0.60)
EPS - Diluted - excluding Extraordinary Items Applicable to Common - Issue Specific Rs (0.26) (0.21) (0.22) (0.28) (0.29) (0.14) (1.07) (0.31) (0.24) (0.23) (0.67) (0.60)
EPS - Diluted - excluding Extraordinary Items - Normalized - Issue Specific Rs (0.26) (0.21) (0.22) (0.28) (0.29) (0.14) (1.07) (0.31) (0.24) (0.23) (0.67) (0.60)
EPS - Diluted from Discontinued Operations & Extraordinary Items Rs 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00
DPS - Common - Gross - Issue - By Announcement Date Rs 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00
DPS - Common - Net - Issue - By Announcement Date Rs 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00
Earnings before Interest & Taxes (EBIT) 10.7 16.6 (21.0) (10.8) (6.2) 1.3 (152.4) (47.2) (52.3) (1.8) (3.5) (4.8)
Earnings before Interest, Taxes, Depreciation & Amortization (EBITDA) 10.7 16.7 (21.0) (10.8) (6.2) 1.5 (152.4) (47.2) (52.3) (1.7) (3.5) (4.8)
Depreciation & Amortization - Supplemental — 0.0 — — — 0.2 — — — — — —
Depreciation Expense - Total - Supplemental — 0.0 — — — 0.2 — — — — — —
Depreciation, Depletion & Amortization - Total — 0.0 — — — 0.2 — — — 0.0 0.0 0.0
Depreciation - Total — 0.0 — — — 0.2 — — — 0.0 0.0 0.0
Normalized after Tax Profit (58.0) (46.3) (49.1) (62.3) (65.0) (31.8) (223.3) (68.7) (52.8) (1.9) (5.4) (4.8)
Normalized Net Income from Continuing Operations (58.0) (46.3) (49.1) (62.3) (65.0) (31.8) (223.3) (68.7) (52.8) (1.9) (5.4) (4.8)
Normalized Net Income - Bottom Line (58.0) (46.3) (49.1) (62.3) (65.0) (31.8) (223.3) (68.7) (52.8) (1.9) (5.4) (4.8)
Earnings before Interest & Taxes (EBIT) - Normalized (53.8) (41.1) (53.3) (59.8) (57.0) (27.9) (214.2) (68.3) (52.3) (1.8) (3.5) (4.8)
Earnings before Interest, Taxes, Depreciation & Amortization (EBITDA) - Normalized — (41.1) — — — (27.6) — — — (1.7) (3.5) (4.8)
Interest Expense 9.2 0.1 4.1 0.1 4.0 2.0 10.5 0.2 0.0 0.0 1.8 0.0
Losses, Benefits & Adjustments - Insurance 10.5 17.6 7.0 25.3 32.5 17.8 36.0 25.4 0.0 — — —
Operating Expenses 143.0 140.0 121.4 113.8 147.6 109.3 417.8 122.3 52.3 7.3 3.5 4.8
Premiums Ceded Out & Unearned - Total 21.2 45.4 7.9 23.3 16.3 38.6 83.6 13.3 0.0 — — —
Selling, General & Administrative Expenses excluding Research & Development Expenses 88.5 79.4 90.1 81.5 73.2 63.5 415.9 71.4 1.8 2.8 4.3 4.5
Total Claim & Loss Expense 10.5 17.6 7.0 25.3 32.5 17.8 36.0 25.4 0.0 — — —
Underwriting Expenses - Insurance 132.5 122.4 114.4 88.6 115.0 91.5 381.8 96.9 52.3 — — —
Income before Taxes & Provision for Loan Losses (63.0) (41.2) (57.5) (59.9) (61.0) (29.8) (224.7) (68.5) (52.3) (1.8) (5.4) (4.8)
Cost of Revenue including Operation & Maintenance (Utility) - Total — — — — — — — — — 5.1 0.0 0.0
Cost of Revenues excluding Depreciation — — — — — — — — — 5.1 0.0 0.0
DPS - Common - Gross - Issue - By Payable Date Rs 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00
DPS - Common - Gross - Issue - By Ex Date Rs 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00
Underwriting Expenses minus Losses, Benefits & Adjustments - Insurance 122.0 104.7 107.3 63.3 82.5 73.7 345.8 71.5 52.3 — — —
Operating Expenses excluding Non-Cash Charges - Total — 140.0 — — — 109.1 — — — 7.2 3.5 4.8
Premiums Earned - Total 143.7 143.1 98.6 91.3 131.4 98.5 240.2 54.7 0.0 — — —
Losses, Benefits & Adjustments - Total 10.5 17.6 7.0 25.3 32.5 17.8 36.0 25.4 0.0 — — —
Income Available to Common Shares before Depreciation & Amortization — (46.2) — — — (31.6) — — — (1.8) (5.3) (4.8)
Fixed Charges 9.2 0.1 4.1 0.1 4.0 2.0 10.5 0.2 — 0.0 1.8 0.0
Net Premiums Written 143.7 143.1 98.6 91.3 131.4 98.5 240.2 54.7 0.0 — — —
Estimated Tax Rate 0.29× 0.29× 0.29× 0.29× 0.29× 0.29× 0.29× 0.29× 0.29× 0.29× 0.29× 0.29×
Total Common & Spl DPS -Gross - Issue - By Announcement Date Rs 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00 0.00

Every line the company reported, in the original order and wording, without regrouping or signs changed. Latest 12 periods; the table above goes back further.